God bless all you who showed up for the all important meeting. !!!The village that I love is no more. I did stand up with others in the past and we stopped HUD. but when we’re not paying attention, I turn around and they call it progress. It’s a crying shame. We were warned the progressive left was coming after the suburbs. Well, they came, and they conquered. The village that we love ,the beauty, the open space ,that’s why people came here. No more!!! elections have consequences. I hope you’re able to stop this project .We The People!!!Deann Sarcone
I think it's a very important question because my guess is that the various proposed multitenant buildings will not increase our Village, Town, or County taxes - but they might very well increase our School taxes significantly - both now and in the future. Michael, identify a few multitenant complexes in the rivertown area and FOIL their school districts for the number of students from those complexes. A litte averaging will give us an expected number of students. Might not be exact, but will certainly be in the ballpark.
However many children show up from those 33 apartments, I bet the $70k/year they pay in school taxes for the next 30 years won’t cover it. We’re on the hook to pay for the mayor’s political ambitions.
Very quick back of the envelope numbers based on my block alone:
20 houses, 14 school aged children. These houses pay on average $7k/year each on school taxes, so that works at about $10k/yr per child.
I’ll call this even if only 7 children are added from Katz.
Interesting and it would be nice to know. Is there any data on where those who won the lottery came from in terms of location; neighboring towns, already residents or different states? Or is all that confidential?
Just curious to know the benefit that the complex has to those within Croton or very close proximity.
So, as Ken Regan explained, the question is not who won the lottery but which on the list the lottery created will actually meet the requirements for renting the apartments. So while there may be 32 apartments (plus one for the live-in manager) that does not mean at all that the first 32 “winners” of the lottery will get them. So until that process is done, we will not know who is moving in nor anything about them. I would suspect they are getting close to being done with that process, however.
I'm curious why folks are focused on the schooling needs of this specific small apartment building. Are you concerned about how many new children are entering the school district every time an existing house is sold or a new house is built? Do you think the town would have been better off if large developments like Half Moon Bay (with 167 units) were never constructed? Even if 50 students living at Maple Commons end up attending school (which would be an extremely high estimate), enrollment would still be down compared to 2020. Shouldn't we be more concerned that, during the past ten years, school enrollment in Croton has decreased by over 11%?
Half Moon Bay is market value, they pay their fair share in property taxes. Same for a new house being built. I’m not opposed to growth as long as I’m not on the hook for subsidizing it.
Who's the "they" here and what's defined as "fair share"? The owner of Maple Commons pays $70,000 per year in taxes (increased at a rate of 3%), funded in part by the rent paid by the tenants. Further, each tenant will contribute a significant amount back into the town via sales tax. As I'm sure you also know, the tax burden of owners/tenants of "market rate" residences varies drastically. Therefore, while it's a fun exercise to focus on the finances of this particular small development that has an immaterial impact on the school system as a whole, maybe we should also determine whether our children are, in fact, getting the best education possible. If we ensure that our children have the best resources in the county -- and not spend countless hours discussing whether the owner of Maple Commons is paying $5,000 per child in taxes while an owner at Half Moon Bay is paying $4,000 per child -- then our town will flourish.
Let’s not get into veiled personal attacks by responding with “Who’s the they?” If you read my reply without malice, “they” refers to the households of the Half Moon Bay.
Look at your school tax bill and tell me if $70k/yr for 33 households sounds fair to you. That’s what I mean by “fair share.” We have elderly people on fixed income who pay more for school taxes than Maple Commons is expected to, $2100/household.
You may have a point for increased tax revenue if more people live here through sales taxes. Since we’re focused on school tax implications, do local sales taxes contribute towards school expenses? Genuine question, not a gotcha.
Speaking of our schools providing the best education possible, I bet you no one disagrees. Personally, I wish their time and energy (and our money) is more focused on academics than exposing the district to lawsuits and defending against them. Here’s to hoping that lawsuit is dead, not because of merits, but because I want my taxes spent on academics, not lawyers. (They in “their” = school district leadership and BOE)
My question is why are people focusing specifically on the tax bill of this particular development that represents a minuscule portion of the town’s overall population? Is it fair that someone at HMB pays $4,000 per year for a unit that also has access to multiple pools, gyms and a clubhouse? Maybe not as well? But I haven't seen anyone particularizing the details of HMB's tax bill (or the tax bill of any other home in Croton for that matter). So, when there are discussions ad nauseum concerning a tax that may in fact amount to a net financial benefit to the school system without any corresponding conversation concerning the “fairness” of how much other residents of Croton are paying in tax, conclusions can be reasonably made concerning the true underlying nature of the inquiry itself. Again, let’s focus on making sure ALL CHILDREN living in Croton have the best education and resources. If we truly believe that Croton is a friendly neighborhood with a small-town charm, that should be our only focus when it comes to the school system and we should accept all new residents with open arms.
Maple Commons is not the only development, however. It is seen in the context of the other projects currently in progress and new ones being pushed through. We’re talking about very rapid growth. The kind of growth that concerns many residents about exactly what you’re mentioning: small-town charm with great schools. It really doesn’t help that we have a mayor who is driving Croton as if it were a rental.
From my point of view, if we keep building multifamily housing at this pace, especially affordable housing, single family homeownership in Croton will become unaffordable. Despite our many trees, none of them are growing any money on them. We either have to increase taxes to keep providing great education and services for our new neighbors, or we have to make cuts. No such thing as free lunch - someone always pays. I’m afraid that we’re heading towards a path that the only way to afford living in Croton will have to be through multifamily housing. The tax burden will be too heavy otherwise. I believe this is exactly what our mayor’s party’s vision for the suburbs is. Nothing wrong with it for some, just absolutely not my cup of tea.
Why would single family homeownership become unaffordable if new multifamily buildings are built? Croton has become much more unaffordable since 2020, the price increases of which have nothing to do with any new developments. I literally don’t understand this argument at all from an economic standpoint. If your concern is affordability, then you should be in favor of new multi-family rental developments. Someone with a tight budget who wants to live in Croton right now has very few options.
In addition, focusing on “fairness” helps no one. Is it fair that the single rich guy with no kids living in a mansion pays $50,000 per year when he doesn’t use the school system? Is it fair that a family of five lives in a small three-bedroom house and pays $10,000/year for three children? If there’s a determination that our school system isn’t top-notch anymore, then there needs to be a discussion holistically about what other town services need to be cut and, maybe, whether taxes need to be increased. But pointing at residents of a particular development isn't part of the Croton spirit.
Your argument may make a bit more sense if enrollment in Croton was increasing. But it’s been decreasing very significantly over the past ten years (11%). Croton had 1,701 students in 2013. It had 1,525 last year. So, unless you were complaining in 2013 that the schools were overcrowded and the budget was too small, there’s clearly room for at least another 175 students.
God bless all you who showed up for the all important meeting. !!!The village that I love is no more. I did stand up with others in the past and we stopped HUD. but when we’re not paying attention, I turn around and they call it progress. It’s a crying shame. We were warned the progressive left was coming after the suburbs. Well, they came, and they conquered. The village that we love ,the beauty, the open space ,that’s why people came here. No more!!! elections have consequences. I hope you’re able to stop this project .We The People!!!Deann Sarcone
I think it's a very important question because my guess is that the various proposed multitenant buildings will not increase our Village, Town, or County taxes - but they might very well increase our School taxes significantly - both now and in the future. Michael, identify a few multitenant complexes in the rivertown area and FOIL their school districts for the number of students from those complexes. A litte averaging will give us an expected number of students. Might not be exact, but will certainly be in the ballpark.
However many children show up from those 33 apartments, I bet the $70k/year they pay in school taxes for the next 30 years won’t cover it. We’re on the hook to pay for the mayor’s political ambitions.
Very quick back of the envelope numbers based on my block alone:
20 houses, 14 school aged children. These houses pay on average $7k/year each on school taxes, so that works at about $10k/yr per child.
I’ll call this even if only 7 children are added from Katz.
Interesting and it would be nice to know. Is there any data on where those who won the lottery came from in terms of location; neighboring towns, already residents or different states? Or is all that confidential?
Just curious to know the benefit that the complex has to those within Croton or very close proximity.
So, as Ken Regan explained, the question is not who won the lottery but which on the list the lottery created will actually meet the requirements for renting the apartments. So while there may be 32 apartments (plus one for the live-in manager) that does not mean at all that the first 32 “winners” of the lottery will get them. So until that process is done, we will not know who is moving in nor anything about them. I would suspect they are getting close to being done with that process, however.
I'm curious why folks are focused on the schooling needs of this specific small apartment building. Are you concerned about how many new children are entering the school district every time an existing house is sold or a new house is built? Do you think the town would have been better off if large developments like Half Moon Bay (with 167 units) were never constructed? Even if 50 students living at Maple Commons end up attending school (which would be an extremely high estimate), enrollment would still be down compared to 2020. Shouldn't we be more concerned that, during the past ten years, school enrollment in Croton has decreased by over 11%?
Half Moon Bay is market value, they pay their fair share in property taxes. Same for a new house being built. I’m not opposed to growth as long as I’m not on the hook for subsidizing it.
Who's the "they" here and what's defined as "fair share"? The owner of Maple Commons pays $70,000 per year in taxes (increased at a rate of 3%), funded in part by the rent paid by the tenants. Further, each tenant will contribute a significant amount back into the town via sales tax. As I'm sure you also know, the tax burden of owners/tenants of "market rate" residences varies drastically. Therefore, while it's a fun exercise to focus on the finances of this particular small development that has an immaterial impact on the school system as a whole, maybe we should also determine whether our children are, in fact, getting the best education possible. If we ensure that our children have the best resources in the county -- and not spend countless hours discussing whether the owner of Maple Commons is paying $5,000 per child in taxes while an owner at Half Moon Bay is paying $4,000 per child -- then our town will flourish.
Let’s not get into veiled personal attacks by responding with “Who’s the they?” If you read my reply without malice, “they” refers to the households of the Half Moon Bay.
Look at your school tax bill and tell me if $70k/yr for 33 households sounds fair to you. That’s what I mean by “fair share.” We have elderly people on fixed income who pay more for school taxes than Maple Commons is expected to, $2100/household.
You may have a point for increased tax revenue if more people live here through sales taxes. Since we’re focused on school tax implications, do local sales taxes contribute towards school expenses? Genuine question, not a gotcha.
Speaking of our schools providing the best education possible, I bet you no one disagrees. Personally, I wish their time and energy (and our money) is more focused on academics than exposing the district to lawsuits and defending against them. Here’s to hoping that lawsuit is dead, not because of merits, but because I want my taxes spent on academics, not lawyers. (They in “their” = school district leadership and BOE)
My question is why are people focusing specifically on the tax bill of this particular development that represents a minuscule portion of the town’s overall population? Is it fair that someone at HMB pays $4,000 per year for a unit that also has access to multiple pools, gyms and a clubhouse? Maybe not as well? But I haven't seen anyone particularizing the details of HMB's tax bill (or the tax bill of any other home in Croton for that matter). So, when there are discussions ad nauseum concerning a tax that may in fact amount to a net financial benefit to the school system without any corresponding conversation concerning the “fairness” of how much other residents of Croton are paying in tax, conclusions can be reasonably made concerning the true underlying nature of the inquiry itself. Again, let’s focus on making sure ALL CHILDREN living in Croton have the best education and resources. If we truly believe that Croton is a friendly neighborhood with a small-town charm, that should be our only focus when it comes to the school system and we should accept all new residents with open arms.
Maple Commons is not the only development, however. It is seen in the context of the other projects currently in progress and new ones being pushed through. We’re talking about very rapid growth. The kind of growth that concerns many residents about exactly what you’re mentioning: small-town charm with great schools. It really doesn’t help that we have a mayor who is driving Croton as if it were a rental.
From my point of view, if we keep building multifamily housing at this pace, especially affordable housing, single family homeownership in Croton will become unaffordable. Despite our many trees, none of them are growing any money on them. We either have to increase taxes to keep providing great education and services for our new neighbors, or we have to make cuts. No such thing as free lunch - someone always pays. I’m afraid that we’re heading towards a path that the only way to afford living in Croton will have to be through multifamily housing. The tax burden will be too heavy otherwise. I believe this is exactly what our mayor’s party’s vision for the suburbs is. Nothing wrong with it for some, just absolutely not my cup of tea.
Why would single family homeownership become unaffordable if new multifamily buildings are built? Croton has become much more unaffordable since 2020, the price increases of which have nothing to do with any new developments. I literally don’t understand this argument at all from an economic standpoint. If your concern is affordability, then you should be in favor of new multi-family rental developments. Someone with a tight budget who wants to live in Croton right now has very few options.
In addition, focusing on “fairness” helps no one. Is it fair that the single rich guy with no kids living in a mansion pays $50,000 per year when he doesn’t use the school system? Is it fair that a family of five lives in a small three-bedroom house and pays $10,000/year for three children? If there’s a determination that our school system isn’t top-notch anymore, then there needs to be a discussion holistically about what other town services need to be cut and, maybe, whether taxes need to be increased. But pointing at residents of a particular development isn't part of the Croton spirit.
Your argument may make a bit more sense if enrollment in Croton was increasing. But it’s been decreasing very significantly over the past ten years (11%). Croton had 1,701 students in 2013. It had 1,525 last year. So, unless you were complaining in 2013 that the schools were overcrowded and the budget was too small, there’s clearly room for at least another 175 students.